What is 15 yrs? Your perception of a dumb Doctor is likely someone who is out of touch or incapable of interacting with others. Sure, some work that nurses do helps doctors, but the majority of nursing work is independent and just as vital (or more) to patient care as doctors work. 1) almost all medical school receive applicants totaling in the thousands. If you are, we have a ton of great articles to help you learn efficiently and make the most out of nursing school. Why Do Nurses Think They Are So Great? 2023 Doctors Reaction score. 4. A doctor who has a good relationship with his or her patient can, if the patient does not understand the risk, still rely on the trust the patient puts into him or her to understand the risks and make the right decisions. According to the Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS), the 2020 median annual salary for nurse practitioners is $111,680. If we account for the fact that only a tiny slice of the entire 160+ IQ population is going to apply each year (people generally earn only one phD in their lifetime, not one per year), then we are left with a tiny fraction of that 230,000 160+ IQ persons who will earn a phD every year, almost certainly less than 1%. telling lies and even CDC starts the droning when all western doctors outside of the US know circumcision is exaggerated advantages at best and a scam at worst. So many persons with average IQ scores do well on the MCAT, USMLE, and A levels. The General Medical Councils state of medical education and practice report, published earlier this month, showed a vicious cycle of doctors leaving because of workload pressures, increasing the load on those left behind. As someone planning on going into medicine Ive seen both sides of the spectrum. Entrance to medical school is only highly competitive in the relatively few countries where medicine is a highly paid and prestigious profession. If people arent besoded by your pedantic musings, it doesnt mean they are dim. The encounter is supposed to embody a therapeutic alliance, one in which a SHARED decision is made. There are plenty of highly intelligent people who get poor grades because they dont care to put in the effort. I have spent time in the US working as a doctor and I agree with the comments made by my colleagues. Remember its online/print, tone is almost impossible to convey, love ya, if Im wrong, Im sorry. I currently see a doctor, who is not very aggressive about my physical well-being, particularly for my age, and because I care about my physical well-being and am an educated patient, I tell him what I need and he does it. Being a good doctor requires more than just book smarts. In addition, they require a great resume showing volunteer, physical and hobbies that provide a well rounded image, 3 recommendation letters that speak of the character of the student, and then go to a medical interview in which usually around 1 in 4 get selected to enter into the medical school. All nurses are the same. However, I am saying that doctors with empathy and human compassion are much better than just doctors with their book smarts. I commonly have to listen At no point should it include references (as these are used to strengthen and support your argument in the body of the text). Better hours, same income, doctor calls you, not the other way around. Doctors take on a large amount of liability. Sunday Worship June 25, 2023 | Stream CCLI #21810036 What about Physicists and Scientists? Even basic medical instruments are getting smarter: For example, new bandages for heart patients have built-in sensors to measure vital signs. Nurses have an ethical responsibility to do what is best for their patients, and it is ultimately their call on how to proceed. And if you are considering a medical career, dont let these false perceptions about nursing turn you off from a potentially rewarding career. Last week I interviewed a doctor who told me that his primary care doc is a physician assistant who has been trained to deliver primary care. Nursing An emergency clinic visit and root canal later, he told his dentist she was fired. After all a doctor assumes a ton of liability, therefore they must retain authority equal to this level of liability. As a victim of the VA medical system, I can say with authority that the emphasis is on pro-forma treatment, particularly for mental health issues. All of you would-be and practicing doctors should simply cut the superiority act. @Dr.Castle i know that just b/c they go thru voulenterr work doesnt mean anything. Thats how it works. Disagree Medicine is a dificult discipline that requires a high degree of logical reasoning. So some of you go to walk in clinics where you dont see the best and brightest of the bunchnot their fault. But he or she was # 176 of 600 if you look at it that way, or #176 of 200 if you look at it another way. It may be true to some extend that some students get these hours without heart but that is no different than any other students. I know because Ive witnessed this throughout my colleagues applications. Hi Im not sure what you are getting at your comment, if you would like to clarify, perhaps I can respond better. A lot of this is caused by lasting misconceptions and stereotypes about nurses that are no longer (or were never) true. Suppose someone comes in with the beginnings of a serious illness, but this persons doctor decides to ignore what the patient says because it disinterests him or because he thinks he knows better about the patients own body. You probably have trouble all over right? 6. Why and When do nurses become so arrogant? : r/nursing It all comes down to communication and whether you feel like youre asking questions and theyre not being answered, says Carolyn Clancy, director of the Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality. yes finally a person with balls to say what most doctors never will admit too i.e. Personally I think that doctors are better actors than scientists. Does your doctor hear you out without interrupting? Only those who are truly qualified and passionate about what they do will make the cut. http://www.statisticbrain.com/iq-estimates-by-intended-college-major/). (Do they have hospital privileges?there are some who choose not to that are still smart though. The job of the doctor is to distribute this to the population so geniuses can work at the frontier in solving the unsolved. So an arrogant doctor, who is a very good surgeon is also more likely to be sued by his patients, not because of the surgical performance but because of his relationship with his patients. If he/she wasnt damn good someone would have already sued them into oblivion. That means that in those cases when the risk came true, the patient is more likely to accept it as something that was unavoidable. While doctors are on call 24 hours a day, seven days a week, nurses work in set shifts every week, A nurse has an undergraduate degree in Nurse There are the nurses who eat their young. No such thing as EQ. Medical students in these countries are typically solid but unremarkable high school graduates (top 1/3 of students). She recalls visiting a doctor for a second opinion on whether she should go through with a procedure recommended by her dentist. The public doesnt seem to realize that most Medical Doctors are doing exactly the same thing with little of their own thought put into it. As for the rest? you nailed it thank you. When I get a 60 yr old man with bilateral pneumonia on triple antibiotic therapy saying Help me with my jacket so I can go smoke I get more than a little annoyed. Later on down the road it turns out this patient has a full blown serious illness, and the doctor didnt catch it because he didnt want to hear the patient out. As someone who has worked extensively with grad students, MDs, PhDs, MD-PhDs, DVMs, DMV-PhDs, and so forth, the degree is more a measure of perseverance, not intelligence nor competence. The General Medical Councils state of medical education and practice report, published earlier this month, showed a vicious cycle of doctors leaving because The few schools with class sizes over 200 recieve applicants in the 10,000s. Becoming an RN isnt easy. But they often times ignore the most important process about medicine, which is analyzing the patient as a whole and listening to what is going on in their body from their perspective. Anna Liza Casem, a Beaumont nurse, was on the front lines during the early days of the COVID-19 pandemic in Michigan when she too got sick. Doctor's don't know anything, patients don't know anything, administrators don't The 10 Mistakes Every Patient Makes, recalls the time her husband developed severe tooth pain on a weekend. Trust me! Having experienced a medical education and an engineering education, I must admit that the engineering curriculum was more challenging in many respects because of the degree of abstract reasoning and logic required, which actually gave me an advantage in medical school because my problem-solvimg abilities were great for unraveling difficult clinical cases (e.g. If you value warmth, you may not be able to build an effective relationship with a physician who seems formal or distant. doctors are not willing to even acknowledge that a patient can even think let alone know what is happening inside their own body. @bris I dont know the stats on engineering Ph.D. iQs but as a profession doctors average rank higher on IQ than all engineering fields. Pharmacy Doctors seem to want pure physical results that they can see- lab results, patients vomiting blood, whatever. However, emerging research reveals a different kind of killing, one in which behavioral changes in doctors cause them to engage in medical serial murder. Really Medaholic? One of the clearest signs you should move on is if he walks out of the room while youre still talking, says Clancy. The nurses primary objective is to to facilitate the care of the patient, and assist the doctor. I so agree! This is not to say MD do not do the same thing, its just whats worked for me. 13,729. Nearly killed by COVID-19, Michigan doctors, nurses return humbled, smarter. After specilizing to say mechanical engineering or ortophedic surgery you know more about that field, but even there, there are better and worse doctors and engineers. Could Nurse Burnout Lead to a Mass Exodus? | The Motley Fool Based on the stats, doctors are not necessarily smarter than many of their patients, just have more book knowledge. managing their diabetes or heart failure etc. Come on! The doctor and nurse shortage means that entry is lenient, and charisma plays more role in medical school entry than grades. But most physicists that I ran into are downright smart. Almost all nurses purposefully chose nursing as a career and went through a rigorous degree program to qualify. Usually those with the most passion, highest grades, most contributions in their lives up to that point etc. That is not the case. Harder To Become A Nurse Hell, you might actually KNOW a plumber. While reckless, incompetent, inept, mad, or just plain dangerous doctors have contributed to these errors for as long as medicine has been practiced, medical serial killing is a relatively new phenomenon (Kaplan, 2009, p. 3). Good grief. [Ive met plenty of medical specialists and ALL of them were far less intelligent than any of my chemistry professors.]. Following that the student needs to do 2 extremely heavy years of medical sciences, then 2 years of hospital rotations with 2 board certification exams the first of which is an 8 hour exam with 322 questions. Ignore me at your professional peril. Doctors Ill assure you no one who is dumb is completing medical school. You're not only wrong, you're stupid as well. 6 common misconceptions about nurses | Brainscape I think an EQ test should be a 2nd admissions exam. I am yet to meet one who is REALLY impressive. Anyone whos name is FUCKPATADAMSwell thats all you need to see to determined where or not you should take what they say seriously. Your primary care physician should be the quarterback of your healthcare team, managing each step of the medical process. Are nurses smarter than resident physicians? High IQ not required for most doctors. Just like you cant compare a engineer and a lawyer. And what do these scientists make? Not really. I wrote a blistering letter to his medical director and insisted on another doctor. See, I got a secret for u. I never did. My philosophy is as follows: Medicine is what I do; it is not who I am. Five things nurses are really good at and sometimes better But I get frustrated by those same patients. Nursing requires accomplishing many complex activities during a shift, from performing difficult, life-saving tasks to doing more mundane paperwork. According to the Bureau of Labor When I find one, Ill let you know. Remember and never forget, a Dr. is NOT the boss. As a result of this new phenomenon, the current study provides a review on reasons why doctors murder their patients. To put it bluntly, medicine is an extremely lucrative field that has a positive image in the society inlarge, pays well, has amazing job stability, and in itself is an accomplishment. They are among the highest IQ of any professional if you take IQ to mean anything. WebThey found that patients treated by female doctors had slightly lower mortality and readmission rates than patients treated by male doctors. You basically live in the hospital for those years. As you can clearly see even if these results were true and accurate there is still huge overlap between the professions, especially those requiring post graduate studies which medicine is (at least in Canada and the US). Moreover, there would be less doctors to help the increasing idiot Americans who do harm to their bodies that can easily be prevented. Look it up, This is so true Im a nurse and deal with this. In short, there are many, many more basic science phDs awarded each year than the number of people born each year with a 160+ IQ. A Doctor Confides, My Primary Doc Laurie, that is most unfortunate. However, when the counselor informed my parents, he also told them that I am distracted and if I do not focus, I would be a case of wasted intelligence. Top 5 Differences Between Nurse Practitioners and Doctors These medical degrees are free or very heavily subsidised. Just know, that if you got into med school, you are intelligent and capable enough to be a doctor. Of course, we have to remember that there are all different kinds of intelligence. I guess that is the difference between a science degree and a communications degree (honestly communications degrees are a joke at my University. Unless either doctor does serious malpractice, there wont be such a big difference between the technical skills of the cited brilliant doctor who doesnt build a relationship with his/her patients, and the one who does build that relationship. Dont be afraid to say I do not know. MCAT + EQ test. To get into a PhD programme you need a 4 year Honours (equivalent to a US Masters) degree with a High Distinction (A+) average. These specialists, of course, dont wait on customers. The only people smarter than me Brainscapes new early childhood app gives kids a powerful head start, How to study in Medical School using Brainscape. []. That said, as a group the PhDs tend to be the most rounded, the MDs best dressed, the MD-PhDs narrowly focussed, the DVM-PhDs, the most knowledgeable generally, and the MD or DVM-pathologists the most interesting fun to work with. How Smart are Medical Doctors? The doctor said the COVID-19 pandemic has only added to a health care-staffing shortage that has been looming for decades. overdeveloped sense of entitlement? 2) despite the poor economic and political climate in medicine, your average applicant is definitely not less gifted than the 70s. What is an EQ? They cant be reached any way (unless you count for useless chit-chat which I dont). everyone, leave doctors alone, they put in the hard work to get to where they are and because of that they deserve it, start complaining after you spend 15+ years getting educated to save people lives, i do still agree about the superiority complex tho. WebEMS personnel have a scope outside of the hospital. First of all, is IQ even a valid way of measuring intelligence? Even more interesting, the role of nursing isn't just different across fields but also across time. Joined Dec 1, 2011 Messages 18,579 Reaction score 52. That means keeping track of specialists reports and instructions and talking with you about their recommendations. In Russia physicians and surgeons earn about $150/week and have low status. This isnt true. WebDifferent Philosophical Focuses. 2. Published Mar 5, 2010 LeLeeFNP Specializes in ICU, CVICU, Surgical, LTAC. Someone with a higher IQ will be able to learn and apply knowledge faster than those with a lower IQ and will therefore make a more competent doctor. WebNurses are overrated and a huge chunk of them are pretty obnoxious. The most incompetent physician or surgeon can only kill one patient at a time. To say they need to integrate more humanities courses into their cirruculum is absurd. Both are needed. i really want to write a long response about the important points this author was making in terms of patient care, and how it truly is more than just standardized tests it was at that point i realized that this would be lost on you. Every year, between 300 and 400 physicians take their own livesroughly one a day (Noonan, 2008). And the more you display a contrary attitude towards them the less time you will find they spend with you, because they feel its a waste of their time. It is very easy to get into a Russian medical school. NewEastCoastRN said: There is a theme echoed throughout these discussions that I think should really be You can be the smartest person in the world and yet have no common sense. Look at your average national requirement for any other profession and they will almost always fall short of the requirements to get into medical school, why? Because there is a large competition for it, why? They also know more about treatments and symptoms. I jest though, as you are obviously intelligent. I know doctors who have drawn blood or run a bunch of tests without telling patients why theyre doing them and what they mean. Its also important that a doctor uses terms you understand, rather than complicated medical jargon; otherwise, explanations are meaningless. Jay Zagorsky from Ohio State University analyzed a sample of 7,500 adults between the ages of 33 and 41. It would also put you at the BOTTOM of engineering, chemistry, physics, mathematics or computer science PhDs. Garlique doesnt work neither does snake oil. What Im impressed with is a down to earth, communicative and caring doc, who also possesses knowledge. When I returned to the clerk & she asked me what date would be best for me I said I would get back to her. I dont know where you inferred that I said being nice is more important than competency of care. document.getElementById( "ak_js" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Im a Canadian internal medicine doctor. I have learned much over the years from patients ,,nurses,EMT, respiratory therapist, and others its always good to listen. Some nurses even work independently or have their own nurse practitioner practices. Lets not even talk about comparing the IQ of a doctor to a Physicist! Give me Dr. House or Dr. Feelgood ANY DAY! Does this mean that a very intelligent, well-rounded person cant be in a different profession? Doctors and high IQs??? If I got results then I would return but when the patient has to both diagnose the problem and treat the problem, I see no reason to return or trust the doctors. Unfortunately, the ever increasing emphasis on test scores (GPA, MCAT, USMLE) may be a bad sign for our future doctors. Medical scientists know more about how the human body works. Its a technical degree. Medical Students certainly need to be exposed to the humanities. It actually lists MDs with an IQ below 100. Does this mean that all medical students are extremely intelligent well-rounded individuals that have amazing grades? period. There are pediatric nurses who are specially trained to work with children, there are forensic nurses who evaluate people in police custody, there are oncological nurses who work with patients with cancer, among many, many more.